THUR July 17 4:00 PM everything down

[jedi]

The ECM at 4:00 PM EDT took out all channels from all servers except the porn channels. Locals were working for a while after the hit - but now they are all gone.
The cards were not hit - they are still good and work in the legally subscribed receivers - but the control words they are spitting out while in the card servers are not unlocking the channels.
Dish Network has done this same thing a few times before - but each time they have had to pull the ECM. Some have said the ECM was affecting their Hooper receivers or maybe some of their older receivers. Maybe they have now found a way so that it does not affect their legally subscribed receivers - so it may be a while before the IKS gurus can fix this.
We may need a new program from Raton - or at least a tweak for his existing program if Dishnet doesn't pull it this time.
If Raton can't fix it - then you'll probably see a mass exodus to XBMC and IPTV in the next few days and weeks. If they thought IKS was a problem - IPTV could put them into cardiac arrest when it takes hold :-)

Time to get out your XBMC receivers and play with them. The IPTV guys that were streaming their channels from legal receivers should still be up - but if they were streaming from IKS receivers then those channels will be down.

[Graeme33smith]

Th last IPTV server tried was simply movie channels, like simply showing movies - I can get that from torrents. Where is pure IPTV with south channels?

[jedi]

Th last IPTV server tried was simply movie channels, like simply showing movies - I can get that from torrents. Where is pure IPTV with south channels?

They are out there - but a lot of them are trying to stay private - just like the private IKS servers. I'm guessing that they are worried that Dishnet/DirecTV could shut down their streaming servers if they find out about them.
If IKS doesn't come back you will see a lot of big public IPTV services become available - if they're the only game in town then the money will start flowing their way and it will be worth while for them to start streaming all channels from legal subscriptions. There are a lot of small guys streaming a few Dishnet/DirecTV channels now to private IPTV receivers - so the technology is there but it is pretty expensive. The hardware that I know of can just do one channel - not like the 20 channels you could do with one card and one DreamBox card server. So if you want to stream 300 channels you are looking at big money. When IKS was working so well - there wasn't much incentive for the big boys to put their money into IPTV - but if IKS is gone they have a wagon load of money to invest in IPTV technology.
With this new IPTV technology there is no need to pull the card from the receiver - so there is no way S.I. can hit the cards - so no ECM can stop them. When Dishnet looks back on this day - it could be the day that crippled Dishnet and DirecTV satellite TV and turned everyone onto IPTV.

[genmax]

They are out there - but a lot of them are trying to stay private - just like the private IKS servers. I'm guessing that they are worried that Dishnet/DirecTV could shut down their streaming servers if they find out about them.
If IKS doesn't come back you will see a lot of big public IPTV services become available - if they're the only game in town then the money will start flowing their way and it will be worth while for them to start streaming all channels from legal subscriptions. There are a lot of small guys streaming a few Dishnet/DirecTV channels now to private IPTV receivers - so the technology is there but it is pretty expensive. The hardware that I know of can just do one channel - not like the 20 channels you could do with one card and one DreamBox card server. So if you want to stream 300 channels you are looking at big money. When IKS was working so well - there wasn't much incentive for the big boys to put their money into IPTV - but if IKS is gone they have a wagon load of money to invest in IPTV technology.
With this new IPTV technology there is no need to pull the card from the receiver - so there is no way S.I. can hit the cards - so no ECM can stop them. When Dishnet looks back on this day - it could be the day that crippled Dishnet and DirecTV satellite TV and turned everyone onto IPTV.

Yes but the providers are also in control of the hardware fully when you dont "remove the cam from ird" so they can easily send a onscreen message with your CID or a unique referance number they can use to ID your account that is being used to do iptv and they will not only shut down the account but now they can easily knock on your door. :)
IPTV is a very big risk if using provider ird or cable boxes, as you can never monitor it 24/7 to see if they decide to popup a nice smessage with your serial id.

Forgot to mention that Charlie and bev ird show the R and S numbers when sat signal is lost.... ;) So if your doing IPTV using their boxes on a rainy day... Getting your info is much easier.

[jedi]

Yes but the providers are also in control of the hardware fully when you dont "remove the cam from ird" so they can easily send a onscreen message with your CID or a unique referance number they can use to ID your account that is being used to do iptv and they will not only shut down the account but now they can easily knock on your door. :)
IPTV is a very big risk if using provider ird or cable boxes, as you can never monitor it 24/7 to see if they decide to popup a nice smessage with your serial id.

Forgot to mention that Charlie and bev ird show the R and S numbers when sat signal is lost.... ;) So if your doing IPTV using their boxes on a rainy day... Getting your info is much easier.
Good points - I never thought of that.
They may have to record every program and edit it to make sure there was no pop up messages to reveal the true identity of the subscribed receivers. But even if they are identified - it only takes of couple of minutes to activate a new receiver to replace it. With the kind of money these guys are going to have - that is going to be peanuts for them. I think Dish Network has just created a monster that they will not be able to control.

Actually Video on Demand seems to be the proffered method of watching TV anyway. Most people don't care if it is live - they just want to watch it - when they want to watch it. They don't care if they are watching something that happened a few hours ago in most cases unless it is something time sensitive like a live sporting event like FIFA, UFC, NASCAR or NFL. I don't mind watching MLB, NHL or even NFL if they get rid of all the dead air time and commercials and show me the entire game without interruptions.

Maybe the wars have just begun :-)

[access_denied]

Yes but the providers are also in control of the hardware fully when you dont "remove the cam from ird" so they can easily send a onscreen message with your CID or a unique referance number they can use to ID your account that is being used to do iptv and they will not only shut down the account but now they can easily knock on your door. :)
IPTV is a very big risk if using provider ird or cable boxes, as you can never monitor it 24/7 to see if they decide to popup a nice smessage with your serial id.

Forgot to mention that Charlie and bev ird show the R and S numbers when sat signal is lost.... ;) So if your doing IPTV using their boxes on a rainy day... Getting your info is much easier.

Dn & Bev show R and S? Really? I have not seen that yet myself but you do present an interesting point.

[jedi]

they will not only shut down the account but now they can easily knock on your door. :)
IPTV is a very big risk if using provider ird or cable boxes, as you can never monitor it 24/7 to see if they decide to popup a nice smessage with your serial id.

In most cases you won't have to worry about them knocking on your door - as most guys now just make up a name and address when they activate a new account - why give them an actual real name and physical address???

If they go a mixture of LIVE TV for certain events and take a chance that they may get a popup message revealing their receiver ID - and then put most of their stuff on recorded content so they can use Video on Demand - then I think they will have success. Video on Demand is what most people want anyway - they want to be able to turn on their TV and to be able to select a movie and watch it from the beginning to the end when they want to watch it. With Video on Demand the pirates can edit out any popup messages that may appear.
If it is a live event like UFC that they are are streaming without delay - and there is a popup message - then that account may get burned but so what - they can have hundreds of accounts on standby to take its place.

[genmax]

Dn & Bev show R and S? Really? I have not seen that yet myself but you do present an interesting point.

Sure emulate it yourself. Leave a box on while picture is good and then unplug coax while box is on, in a min or two the switch and signal aquirng msg pops up and u get ur R and S right on top.


As for VOD i do believe that VOD is already 100% free on xbmc using mashup and other plugins. I thought the whole reason for IPTV was to get LIVE TV ? Whats the point of paying someone to stream you a movie or a show you can easily grab for free using some widely known and very updated plugins ?

Sure the addy popup might not knock the door if its a fake door, however when calculating the cost of streaming a few channels it adds up. And when a account is closed the equipment is also blacklisted. So if you were to activate 7 IRDS and by gods grace u were never audited. You can only stream 7 physical channels. At which point the cost of maintaining a GOOD stream is roughly 100 bucks per 7 channels. As i am 100% positive charles will not allow you to have 50 boxes in 1 account hehe. Calculating as an Average of 100 per 7, you can do the math of doing 50 channels would be around 5,000 per month and thats only 50 channels... Now when they pop an account due to on screen msgs, you loose your equipment costs and account cost. Plus dont forget to factor in server costs, and the fact that IPTV is 100% hacker friendly, if you make a google search you will see many dumped tokens and streams from larger companies with very tight security. So you must also account for surplus server costs you will need inorder to keep hackers happy and your users.
As overloading any stream server will result in buffering...

[jedi]

Sure emulate it yourself. Leave a box on while picture is good and then unplug coax while box is on, in a min or two the switch and signal aquirng msg pops up and u get ur R and S right on top.


As for VOD i do believe that VOD is already 100% free on xbmc using mashup and other plugins. I thought the whole reason for IPTV was to get LIVE TV ? Whats the point of paying someone to stream you a movie or a show you can easily grab for free using some widely known and very updated plugins ?

Sure the addy popup might not knock the door if its a fake door, however when calculating the cost of streaming a few channels it adds up. And when a account is closed the equipment is also blacklisted. So if you were to activate 7 IRDS and by gods grace u were never audited. You can only stream 7 physical channels. At which point the cost of maintaining a GOOD stream is roughly 100 bucks per 7 channels. As i am 100% positive charles will not allow you to have 50 boxes in 1 account hehe. Calculating as an Average of 100 per 7, you can do the math of doing 50 channels would be around 5,000 per month and thats only 50 channels... Now when they pop an account due to on screen msgs, you loose your equipment costs and account cost. Plus dont forget to factor in server costs, and the fact that IPTV is 100% hacker friendly, if you make a google search you will see many dumped tokens and streams from larger companies with very tight security. So you must also account for surplus server costs you will need inorder to keep hackers happy and your users.
As overloading any stream server will result in buffering...

Some good points - but I think replacing cards and receivers if they are burnt isn't a significant cost to them. There are ways of getting more than 6 or 7 receivers on one account :-)

The big cost is in the streaming devices - each one will be about $200 - so if you are looking at streaming 300 channels that alone is an initial investment of $60,000 - but that is just a one time investment. Like I said there are ways to get more than 6 receivers on an account - but let's pretend that 6 is the most we can do - so then to get 300 channels we would need 300 receivers and at 6 receivers per account that means 50 accounts. Some accounts only need Basic Smart Package - then some Top 120 then Top 200 and so on - so let's say it is $150 average per account then that is $7500 per month. Your are also going to have to stream all of these channels - so you are looking at some server costs each month for the bandwidth, etc.
We all just saw a sort of underground IKS service - Gator TV exposed and they had about 11000 clients - so let's say they just make $5 per month from these clients alone - that's $55,000 monthly. In my opinion they could easily afford to set up their own IPTV service by themselves and there are guys out there way bigger than them.
We have all seen the big boys sharing their caches or all pooling their resources - so there is a huge pot of money available to fund IPTV.

Even DirecTV and Dishnet themselves are getting more and more into Video on Demand - they are advertising "watch what you want to watch - when you want to watch it" you don't have to follow somebody's time table - just select what you want to watch and press the button and voila - it's there.

[jedi]

You can only stream 7 physical channels. At which point the cost of maintaining a GOOD stream is roughly 100 bucks per 7 channels. As i am 100% positive charles will not allow you to have 50 boxes in 1 account hehe. Calculating as an Average of 100 per 7, you can do the math of doing 50 channels would be around 5,000 per month and thats only 50 channels...

I've had a few pops tonight - but if my math is right - I think to do 49 channels would require about 7 accounts (7 receviers per account times 7 accounts would equal 49 channels).
So if each account costs $100 then you are looking at $700 per month for those 7 accounts not $5000.
If you want to do 300 channels - then you're looking at about 43 accounts - or $4300 monthly based on your cost analysis.

[riverman]

The other problem with IPTV is the data use. I have MLB.TV and my data use was more than 300 gigs in June and only to watch for a few hours each day. How many gigs do most internet plans provide? I am sure it is less than the 400 I am allowed. Just another point MLB.tv is expensive and sucks. It buffers many times over the course of a game also their server kicks me off regularly and the picture quality changes many times during a game. I know it is not my internet. Fta with occasional freezing is surely better than what MLB.TV provides so what will less expensive or free IPTV sources provide?

[dishuser]

Some good points - but I think replacing cards and receivers if they are burnt isn't a significant cost to them. There are ways of getting more than 6 or 7 receivers on one account :-)

The big cost is in the streaming devices - each one will be about $200 - so if you are looking at streaming 300 channels that alone is an initial investment of $60,000 - but that is just a one time investment. Like I said there are ways to get more than 6 receivers on an account - but let's pretend that 6 is the most we can do - so then to get 300 channels we would need 300 receivers and at 6 receivers per account that means 50 accounts. Some accounts only need Basic Smart Package - then some Top 120 then Top 200 and so on - so let's say it is $150 average per account then that is $7500 per month. Your are also going to have to stream all of these channels - so you are looking at some server costs each month for the bandwidth, etc.
We all just saw a sort of underground IKS service - Gator TV exposed and they had about 11000 clients - so let's say they just make $5 per month from these clients alone - that's $55,000 monthly. In my opinion they could easily afford to set up their own IPTV service by themselves and there are guys out there way bigger than them.
We have all seen the big boys sharing their caches or all pooling their resources - so there is a huge pot of money available to fund IPTV.

Even DirecTV and Dishnet themselves are getting more and more into Video on Demand - they are advertising "watch what you want to watch - when you want to watch it" you don't have to follow somebody's time table - just select what you want to watch and press the button and voila - it's there.
if one was caught streaming they would kill all of them

[jb26]

Valid control words....looks like dnet quit their silly shenanigans within 24 hours like the past couple times.

edit: or correct me if I'm wrong....i'm not able to check an actual tv screen

[jedi]

Yep - we are getting channels back. All channels should be back before too long.

[genmax]

Did anyone log the stream ? Is so would be nice if it was posted MINUES THE cam info, to see the structure there is deff an answer in the stream if you look hard enough.

[jedi]

Looks like they were still screwing up some of their legal subscribers - so they had to pull the ECM again.

[dvp99ca]

theres too much money to be made so i dont think iks will totally be shutdown anytime soon.

[c8rbk1ng]

theres too much money to be made so i dont think iks will totally be shutdown anytime soon.

Well, that's not up to the IKS providers. When Dish decides they want to shut it down...they will, and then a new form of piracy will appear and these "the sky is falling" posts will disappear :)