Odd train of thought I'm sharing

[jvvh5897]

The other day I saw 60 minutes show that showed how military is trying to defeat satellites. Space based interception, ground based signal blockage and the use of lasers seems to be the main ideas. But this morning one of those flat mirror solar collectors came to my mind and then I recalled Mythbuster's show on trying to start a wood ship on fire with mirrors. I wonder how well a group of a couple thousand satellite hobbyists might do at something along those lines. Back of the envelope math says that one would need to aim a flat mirror within 0.003 degree to bounce sun up to geosync sat. Say, you buy a space blanket and stretch it on a wooden frame and hook it up to a dish with a motor--could one track the sun and bounce it's 1000 Watt/s energy up to orbit well enough to heat up a bird enough to fry something--how about just get enough energy up there to block uplink signals? Not saying one should--that would be illegal. Might a small group of folks disrupt satellite signal for a few thousand buck in this way? How about other ways that could be very cheap, DIY satellite defeat? When might something like that be interesting to try in the abstract?

[steveOtoo]

Very odd train of thought indeed. However i don't think you can concentrate enough enough light energy without being diffracted thru the atmosphere itself. Lasers on the otherhand are concentrated enough to penetrate out to space.......Ya gotta watch those Chinese though

[Terryl]

I've used old satellite dishes as solar cookers, you can spray the pan with contact glue and apply a film of aluminum foil, or remove the paint and put a very high polish on the metal (do this inside or you may cook yourself) the point where the LNB was is where the main heat will be, this can cook a can of beans real fast.

A 10 footer melted lead, but you had to be very careful to not point it at something flammable, wood siding will burst into flames in seconds, so will someones hair.

A 10 footer can also boil water real fast, if the water boiler is constructed right you can power a steam engine or turbine, it can produce some nice power.

There are plans for a Sun tracker that will interface to the dishes motor, however the standard dish linear motor will only track at one elevation, so a dual axes motor is needed, one that will track East to West and 0 to 90 degrees, this will keep the Sun at the prime focal area dawn to dusk, the tracker will then return the dish to the correct position to start up the next morning.


And Steve is right, you could not bulid or get enough reflectors together to make a differance on a satellite, they go through a +120 to - 120 degree "C" change as they orbit.

[Nostradamus]

why not just get a transmitter with about 10KW output, tune to the right frequency and aim it at the bird you want to kill. You wont't it out permanently but you would over ride what is on there now I would think. Oh wait! I think Capt Midnight did that to HBO about 25 years ago

[ftanewbie]

nice post...but in todays world i think u will be charge in committing some kind terrorist act;)

[fn59]

I thought about this before, but instead of light I was thinking about using the magnetron from a microwave oven.

[Nostradamus]

funny thing is, IKS goes down and somebody can't watch their favorite show ther is somebody dumb enough to actually try something that stupid. I am sure messing with communication satellites is a federal offense LOL

[alex70olds]

I've used old satellite dishes as solar cookers, you can spray the pan with contact glue and apply a film of aluminum foil, or remove the paint and put a very high polish on the metal (do this inside or you may cook yourself) the point where the LNB was is where the main heat will be, this can cook a can of beans real fast.

A 10 footer melted lead, but you had to be very careful to not point it at something flammable, wood siding will burst into flames in seconds, so will someones hair.

A 10 footer can also boil water real fast, if the water boiler is constructed right you can power a steam engine or turbine, it can produce some nice power.

There are plans for a Sun tracker that will interface to the dishes motor, however the standard dish linear motor will only track at one elevation, so a dual axes motor is needed, one that will track East to West and 0 to 90 degrees, this will keep the Sun at the prime focal area dawn to dusk, the tracker will then return the dish to the correct position to start up the next morning.


And Steve is right, you could not bulid or get enough reflectors together to make a differance on a satellite, they go through a +120 to - 120 degree "C" change as they orbit.

I probably have enough stuff on my desk to build one, minus the 2 Hydraulic cylinders with linear transducers. Could power it all with Solar Panels mounted to the assembly.

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[Terryl]

why not just get a transmitter with about 10KW output, tune to the right frequency and aim it at the bird you want to kill. You wont't it out permanently but you would over ride what is on there now I would think. Oh wait! I think Capt Midnight did that to HBO about 25 years ago

I also think he is still in prison.........

[fn59]

I don't think anyone here is actually going to try and knock out a satellite, just an intellectual exercise.

[jvvh5897]

As I understand it, freedom of speech allows one to think/post about this type of thing, but if there is a "call to action" it becomes a crime.

I was thinking about it a little more yesterday, and I think the idea is pretty much like causing "snow blindness" or snow burn. The scale for the eye and snow flakes is about 0.008 degrees. But I was off by at least an order of magnitude for something on the earth and something in space--0.003 degree is 1 mile at 22.5K miles. So, I'm thinking that you can't aim that close for a burn, but might be able to jiggle the reflector (or just rely on the atmospheric turbulence) to get a big noise spike at the bird in orbit (or drone, or airplane).

For a less obvious use the idea is pretty much the same as asking what is the best way to use a reflector on the ground to signal an airplane if you are stranded in the forest and just want to signal where you are. What if you don't know where the plane is--do you use a hemisphere tessellated with some sort of geometric shape that when giggled or spun will reflect to all angles?

Isn't this also pretty close to the use of reflective paint on highway signs. Or those non-electric signs that look like a bunch of sequins hanging in the wind?

[Terryl]

Just hang one of Liberace's old outfits on a pole, more sequins on them then at the store.

[1boxman]

If someone would hack into the control center and a just geosync orbit .or recalculate the gps reading off by a few..presto .. fuzzy picture :yes:

[burnsy]

Wow you guys are amazing just the fact that one guy has a thought and then a bunch of others jump in the technical know how you guys have is awe inspiring Alex does your deck look like a NASA test facility I can only imagine what Terry has kicking around there are small countries that are not as well equiped

[fn59]

As I understand it, freedom of speech allows one to think/post about this type of thing, but if there is a "call to action" it becomes a crime.

I was thinking about it a little more yesterday, and I think the idea is pretty much like causing "snow blindness" or snow burn. The scale for the eye and snow flakes is about 0.008 degrees. But I was off by at least an order of magnitude for something on the earth and something in space--0.003 degree is 1 mile at 22.5K miles. So, I'm thinking that you can't aim that close for a burn, but might be able to jiggle the reflector (or just rely on the atmospheric turbulence) to get a big noise spike at the bird in orbit (or drone, or airplane).

For a less obvious use the idea is pretty much the same as asking what is the best way to use a reflector on the ground to signal an airplane if you are stranded in the forest and just want to signal where you are. What if you don't know where the plane is--do you use a hemisphere tessellated with some sort of geometric shape that when giggled or spun will reflect to all angles?

Isn't this also pretty close to the use of reflective paint on highway signs. Or those non-electric signs that look like a bunch of sequins hanging in the wind?

One thing you should have if out in the woods is a mylar blanket. Highly reflective and will keep you warm also. Available anywhere they sell camping supplies.

[alex70olds]

Wow you guys are amazing just the fact that one guy has a thought and then a bunch of others jump in the technical know how you guys have is awe inspiring Alex does your deck look like a NASA test facility I can only imagine what Terry has kicking around there are small countries that are not as well equiped

lol not really. It is actually a work desk I set up in my office so I don't have to go out to the shop. It is amazing what can be done for relatively cheep. The 2 screens on the left are 12 inch touch screen HMI PLC. One is by Horner, the other is by Unitronics. My cost is around $1000 for the Unitronics and aprox. $1500 for the Horner. I prefer these over Alllen Bradley, Siemens etc. because the development SW is free. They are easily networked by either CANBUS or Ethernet. IO modules are also relatively cheap. My work is focused mainly on Hydraulic Control Systems, but it is easy to control other applications. For anybody that is interested, you could start your own project free with out even the H/W. It is a great way to learn, and a VERY marketable job skill.

SW, Tech Data etc. free DL Here ~
http://www.unitronics.com/support/downloads

Getting started Manual Here ~
http://www.unitronics.com/Downloads/Support/Technical%20Library/VisiLogic%20Software/Software%20Manuals/VisiLogic%20-%20Getting_Started.pdf

jvvh5897, I remember your work on STBs dating back to Cruelio's site. I have always admired your work, but the above is were I have had to concentrate my time on for the past several years.

Here are a few screen shots of a project I did that was not hydraulic related.
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This is what it controls ~

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Anyway, if anybody is interested in a project utilizing the above, I am in.

[burnsy]

I guess you guys don't realize just how intelligent you are and the vast amount of knowledge you have accumulated not to mention the impact you have on dude like me looking at the kind of stuff you guys are talking about it is truly wonderful to read I just wish I was smart enough to comprehend it all keep up this kind of posting guys it is amazing to read not that I understand half of it lol truly an honor to get to read

[burnsy]

Oh i am in by the way heres my bud 24204 and heres my dish 24205 ok could not resist I promise I will only read in this thread from here out

[burnsy]

i am not so sure, as i have seen similar announcements on via cards...

Maybe somebody else has more precise information?

wtf !!!!!!

[PMP]

Reading this thread made me think that maybe jvvh5897 might be Vladimir Putin fishing for new ideas. I just finished reading an article about new weapons that the Russians claim to posess.

'Russia is boasting a major advance in electronic warfare technology enabling Vladimir Putin’s armed forces to zap foreign military satellites, and “switch off” enemy weapons.

The new system will muzzle the guidance systems of Western cruise missiles and other high-precision arms, it is claimed.

Its Russian makers say it is a “fundamentally new electronic warfare system” which can be mounted on ground-based as well as air- and sea-borne carriers.

Russia’s Radio-Electronic Technologies Group (KRET) deputy chief Yuri Mayevsky said: “The system will target the enemy’s deck-based, tactical, long-range and strategic aircraft, electronic means and suppress foreign military satellites’ radio-electronic equipment.”


Vlad is that you?

[Mavrick]

Reading this thread made me think that maybe jvvh5897 might be Vladimir Putin fishing for new ideas. I just finished reading an article about new weapons that the Russians claim to posess.

'Russia is boasting a major advance in electronic warfare technology enabling Vladimir Putin’s armed forces to zap foreign military satellites, and “switch off” enemy weapons.

The new system will muzzle the guidance systems of Western cruise missiles and other high-precision arms, it is claimed.

Its Russian makers say it is a “fundamentally new electronic warfare system” which can be mounted on ground-based as well as air- and sea-borne carriers.

Russia’s Radio-Electronic Technologies Group (KRET) deputy chief Yuri Mayevsky said: “The system will target the enemy’s deck-based, tactical, long-range and strategic aircraft, electronic means and suppress foreign military satellites’ radio-electronic equipment.”


Vlad is that you?

This kind of stuff should be posted here..........

http://www.satfix.net/forumdisplay.php?772-Business-Science-amp-Technology

[jvvh5897]

Nope, not Russian. Sure wish that the think tanks would pick me up--I have a degree--in Science!

[Gates07]

it has been known for years that the russians can turn OFF the us gps system any time they want to, so much for us military gps guidance systems being really good, all the old time nav aids have been shut down

[jets]

The only "rumor" in this thread: "IKS going down" , that a rumor LOL.


funny thing is, IKS goes down and somebody can't watch their favorite show ther is somebody dumb enough to actually try something that stupid. I am sure messing with communication satellites is a federal offense LOL