How can DISH prove an IPTV subscriber is actually viewing their service? A subscriber may only be watching foreign channels. How can they demand payment for something that is not used?
Senior Member
How can DISH prove an IPTV subscriber is actually viewing their service? A subscriber may only be watching foreign channels. How can they demand payment for something that is not used?
Banned
logs
it's a 2 way street
you can't view anything unless you request it
of course that's assuming there are any logs
Visiting Dignitary
Originally Posted by dogdayz
They can demand what they want but you have the option to refuse it. Then they can choose to file an action or not if you refuse. Your question would perhaps be your defense if they filed an action saying you subscribe to the IPTV service but did not view their service therefore your not liable as you did not infringe on their copyright.
In a Civil action the bar for proving is far less than Criminal. I am not a lawyer but think a Court could be persuaded it was more likely than not.
“a preponderance of the evidence.” This standard requires the jury to return a judgment in favor of the plaintiff if the plaintiff is able to show that a particular fact or event was more likely than not to have occurred.
GS2
Senior Member
LOL!
So if I own a Lamborghini the cops can ticket me without radar proof because the court would assume if I bought that car it must mean I drive at 200 mph when no one is looking.
Moderator Satfix NFL 2024 Week 1,3,11,12&13 Champ
The question is not whether you bought
The question is did you use it
You're allowed to buy a Speed Radar, you're not allowed to use it
Reply to dish letter ---
As I was surfing the net, an ad poped up advertising IPTV
I clicked and was forwarded to a check out window
I paid, and I'm still waiting for something to happen
Nothing is playing on my TV --- I got scammed
Can you guys get it going for me,
Visiting Dignitary
LOL!
So if I own a Lamborghini the cops can ticket me without radar proof because the court would assume if I bought that car it must mean I drive at 200 mph when no one is looking.
However this is not reasonable example because speeding tickets fall under a bar of Criminal proof in Court not a Civil one as I posted. A good way to look at this is OJ where he was found not guilty because they did not meet the burden of proof standard required in Criminal but in Civil Court they meet the much lower standard and he was found to be liable.
In Civil it can come down to which is more likely than not.
GS2
Visiting Dignitary
Your welcome to try that but these type of defenses have been brought up before in previous cases and were not met with much success. Always best to consult a lawyer who can look up the law they allege you inflinged, look up case law, then formulate a defense.
GS2
Banned
sure ... send me $20 and I'll tell you how
VIP
lol.................sure ... send me $20 and I'll tell you how
Visiting Dignitary
If you ever get a demand and decide to fight it if they file an action you have to make sure there is no self-incriminating posts you made. Deleting them might not work either because they might have saved them and then it looks like you went to hide it. Someone could try to make a defense they did not know it was illegal, the web site was operating as if it was legal, if it did, but you better be clean. On one hand ignorance is not an excuse but on the other hand Mens rea is a Criminal defense but in civil litigation, a party’s state of mind can be a deciding factor as to the question of liability and damages also.
If you subscribe to a IPTV service and are a member at a site it should be completely different information that can not be linked together so that if you have and want to post your freetv service at a site like this one that it is not working or its freezing its completely independent from the information you signed up with at IPTV Provider and you must keep that private, not share with anyone.
GS2
Visiting Dignitary
Looks like this one is moving towards default judgment. They requested extentions for filing a defense but that came and went.
12/04/2019 15 TEXT ORDER: Based on the oral agreement between the parties, the time for defendants Boom Media LLC, Debra Henderson and John Henderson to answer or otherwise respond to the complaint is extended to 12/9/2019. So Ordered by U.S. Magistrate Judge Andrew T. Baxter on 12/4/2019. (nmk) (Entered: 12/04/2019)
12/12/2019 16 Letter Motion from Timothy M. Frank Attorney for Plaintiffs and John Henderson Defendant for DISH Network L.L.C., NagraStar LLC requesting Defendants' Extension of Time to Respond to Complaint submitted to Judge Andrew T. Baxter . (Frank, Timothy) (Entered: 12/12/2019)
12/13/2019 17 TEXT ORDER: granting 16 Letter Request. The time for defendants Boom Media LLC, Debra Henderson and John Henderson to answer or otherwise respond to the complaint is extended to 12/24/2019. So Ordered by U.S. Magistrate Judge Andrew T. Baxter on 12/13/2019. (nmk) (Entered: 12/13/2019)
12/27/2019 18 REQUEST FOR ENTRY OF DEFAULT as to Boom Media LLC, Debra Henderson, John Henderson by DISH Network L.L.C., NagraStar LLC. (Attachments: # 1 Declaration of Timothy Frank, # 2 Exhibits 1-4 to Frank Declaration)(Frank, Timothy) (Entered: 12/27/2019)
12/27/2019 19 CLERK'S ENTRY OF DEFAULT as to Debra Henderson, John Henderson, and Boom Media LLC, approving the # 18 Request for Entry of Default. (kmp) (Entered: 12/27/2019)
12/30/2019 CLERKS NOTICE Re 19 Clerks Entry of Default: Counsel is directed to file the appropriate motion for default judgment within 30 days from the date of this notice. Please consult Local Rule 55.2(a) and (b) with respect to the procedure that must be followed seeking judgment by default, now that this clerks entry has been entered. (ban) (Entered: 12/30/2019)
12/30/2019 20 TEXT ORDER: In light of the 19 Clerk's Entry of Default, the Rule 16 conference set for 1/22/2020 and 1/15/2020 deadline for the submission of a joint Civil Case Management Plan and exchange of Mandatory Disclosures are ADJOURNED WITHOUT DATE. The hearing and related deadlines will be reset, if deemed necessary, at a later date. So Ordered by U.S. Magistrate Judge Andrew T. Baxter on 12/30/2019. (nmk) (Entered: 12/30/2019)
GS2
Senior Member
OK, Right,
If I got a letter, I would go to court.
Find out how many months I watched Tv and then muliply that my the most pricy cable bill. 12 months at $79.00 bucks =$948.00
then I'm done, You can't charge me more than what a provider would have charged me.
Visiting Dignitary
Unfortunately it does not work that way. The only reason to say so would be so one would not think so. They can ask for a penalty allowable under the the law ( Civil Section ) they allege you infringed. The judge will assessed the amount. To get a better understanding of what that amount would be would be to speak to a lawyer to try to find an average amount. If you don't defend the action then the Court will like give the amount the Plaintiff requests.
If you go to court as you suggested, its up to the Court. You could get a lenient amount or not so. That is why I say to check for an average. You can sure argue they should not receive more than what they would have received if you had subscribed but they will argue counter to that. They will argue other harm to their business, reputation and costs. They would not want to set a low amount others could try to follow on.
GS2
Member
Not even close to be accurate.
If you lose you will have to pay actual damages (what the provider lost in subscription charges), punitive damages (a huge penalty to make an example of you to others), your attorney fees AND the other party's attorney fees and costs to bring you to court.
Junior Member
Hey GS2! Badchicken/IKSTroll...and countless other screen names I used over the years, remember me?
I'm in Ontario. Nobody I know here in Canada ever got a demand letter, even from waaaay back in the good ol' DAVE days.
i'm not saying it never happened, I'm just saying it's extremely rare.
Anyway, I'm palliative with neuroendocrine cancer and on Disability. They can come after me all they want, I got nothing to take.
I realize everyone's situation is different, but unless you're a dealer I wouldn't sweat it.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote